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Sticky:Dev Blog: Bidding Farewell to the In-game Browser

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 30 post(s)
Steve Ronuken Fuzzwork Enterprises Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM 6039	Posted - 2016.06.20 17:00:59 - [1] - Quote RIP IGB. You were good in your time, but it's time to lay down your burden. Woo! CSM XI! Fuzzwork Enterprises Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter
Steve Ronuken Fuzzwork Enterprises Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM 6039	Posted - 2016.06.20 17:54:44 - [2] - Quote Rivr Luzade wrote: Can someone tell me how to add EVE properly to Steam so that I can test that overlay? Using "Add a Non-Steam Game" with the exe file from "...\EVE\tq\eve.exe" apparently does not do the trick. I cannot load the overlay with the set up hotkey. If you add the (new, not the one that's going away) eve launcher as the non-steam game, the overlay will work just fine with the launched clients. Yes, there's still UI blocking. Woo! CSM XI! Fuzzwork Enterprises Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter
Steve Ronuken Fuzzwork Enterprises Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM 6039	Posted - 2016.06.20 18:56:46 - [3] - Quote Huang Mo wrote: How about you keep IGB until CREST can provide the same features ? One thing is that ALT-TABBING in and out of the game hurts immersion, but it's quite another thing to remove features that people rely on - like the Contracts interface Some handwaving that it will be dealt with "in the future" is not enough. We know how that plays out: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=5127183#post5127183 two years ago and nothing happened Funny you should say that: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=485359&find=unread Woo! CSM XI! Fuzzwork Enterprises Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter
Steve Ronuken Fuzzwork Enterprises Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM 6039	Posted - 2016.06.21 12:30:23 - [4] - Quote Ahuraa wrote: I dont understand any of this. You are removing a function in the game and then say you want third-party devs to take over with CREST. I have googled and i have not found any software named Crest that does the function of checking Jita prices. Where is this CREST you talk about all the time, are you creating this software into the game or are you contracting other to crate this Crest Software that i can use to check prices? Wouldn't it be better to use the money you spent on Project discovery, that does nothing for the game, to keep up the IGB so we can use it for TRADING, THAT IS PART OF THE GAME? https://www.fuzzwork.co.uk/market/viewer/ perhaps? CREST isn't a bit of software. It's an API for developers to use, to get access to data from CCP. Woo! CSM XI! Fuzzwork Enterprises Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter
Steve Ronuken Fuzzwork Enterprises Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM 6041	Posted - 2016.06.21 17:11:28 - [5] - Quote Emrys Alf wrote: This is all after telling us all that overlays were illegal.. is the left hand talking to the right.. HyperFlareX wrote: Another overlay alternative would be Evolve's overlay. As a Mac user this is hard... What do we use? Wormhole mapping wonder how that is going to work? Uh, you mean the one where the security team specifically calls out browser overlays as ok? https://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/overlays-isk-buyer-amnesty-and-account-security/ Quote: We also do NOT consider it unfair if you use other comfort overlays which do not affect how the game is played. This includes overlays for chat and IM applications, the Steam overlay, and Web-Browser overlays for example. Woo! CSM XI! Fuzzwork Enterprises Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter
Steve Ronuken Fuzzwork Enterprises Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM 6041	Posted - 2016.06.22 13:06:07 - [6] - Quote Something which I've had pointed out to me, which may be of use for mac users: http://heliumfloats.com/ Floating browser window, with customizable translucency, and it doesn't intercept clicks through it (when translucent) I'm not a mac user, but it may be of interest to people. Woo! CSM XI! Fuzzwork Enterprises Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter
Steve Ronuken Fuzzwork Enterprises Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM 6041	Posted - 2016.06.22 19:31:26 - [7] - Quote Tass Caffington wrote: Did CCP just kill Tripwire? hmmmmm..... Only if Tripwire doesn't update to using the location service CCP have provided. Woo! CSM XI! Fuzzwork Enterprises Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter
Steve Ronuken Fuzzwork Enterprises Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM 6045	Posted - 2016.06.23 12:02:49 - [8] - Quote MicroNova wrote: I completely understand the motives for wanting to get away from the IGB. However, CREST is missing some very useful API's in comparison. This won't be a 1:1 change over by a far stretch, we're going to lose substantial capability from mature tool sets. Before you take away the IGB can you please update CREST to offer the following? - Report when a character logs in to the game client - Return the name and type of ship being flown - Report if a character is docked or not Without the above we lose the ability to: - Track online vs offline pilots. - Track the ship being flown which in turn allows tracking mass used on a WH, fleet comp (Kitchen SINK!!!!!), and other details. - Track new links vs pilots who have been podded to K space stations. - And to be purposefully vague, cross coordinate with other data for some really useful advanced features. The creators of other mapping tools should chime in, but I think the above covers the vast majority of capability that everyone has pretty much universally implemented as well as providing the tools we need to implement (or maintain) more advanced features. Pretty please? The IGB doesn't allow for reporting on online/offline. (sure, you can look at who's coming in with an IGB user agent, but that's far from perfect. easily spoofable) With fleet comp, there's a crest endpoint which returns all of that (including where the pilot is and what ship they're flying) The location endpoint does let you know if they're in station or not. Woo! CSM XI! Fuzzwork Enterprises Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter
Steve Ronuken Fuzzwork Enterprises Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM 6049	Posted - 2016.06.25 16:21:22 - [9] - Quote LoneRider wrote: I had a web software that could track members and fleet mates using the ingame browser, without the need for any authentication stuff (like API). They just had to use a link posted from the fleet commander, open it in ingame browser and were tracked and displayed on the commander's map until they closed the ingame browser. I suppose that is DEAD now - i don't see a way to implement that using the CREST stuff - each user would have to make some kind of authentification, which makes this completely unusable. Or... ...is there any other way to access other peoples' locations in a way that they dont have to do API authentification? People have to be able to "authenticate" my application to access their position with just one click, and revoke that with another click. Is that possible without the IGB? Only the fleet boss needs to auth to get access to all fleet member locations. Logging in with SSO, to a site to track fleet details. https://github.com/fuzzysteve/fleetTracker is a very very basic example of how you can use it. (There's a slight delay between actions, and them showing up in the results. Each system reports who's in it to the fleet node, once every 30 seconds. those 30 seconds can be slightly off set from each other, depending on the system) Woo! CSM XI! Fuzzwork Enterprises Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter
Steve Ronuken Fuzzwork Enterprises Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM 6053	Posted - 2016.06.26 17:50:13 - [10] - Quote Esrevid Nekkeg wrote: Cismet wrote: ... but I never expected moving him/her to a different team. ... FoxFour hasn't moved to another team, he's no longer working for CCP. And just to be clear, he left for his own reasons. Woo! CSM XI! Fuzzwork Enterprises Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter
Steve Ronuken Fuzzwork Enterprises Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM 6077	Posted - 2016.07.02 23:36:06 - [11] - Quote Burn Monroe wrote: I understand the desire to remove the in game browser. I'm sure it's huge amounts of work to maintain. But, I'm very concerned that this will significantly disrupt WH life. Right now, WH residents use things like siggy or tripwire with the IGB. So, when you want to come back from HS, you just right click the system closest to your WH, from the WH mapping software, and select "Set destination". I know that CREST allows for this as well, but what if the person has multiple characters on different accounts? How is that going to be accommodated? Mainly this will be a problem because even if the WH mapping tool allowed logging into two accounts with CREST, you'd have to log out of one to login with the other. And I'm guessing that would then invalidate your original CREST login, no? I think the easiest way is to give your main account approval to be the authorizer for your other accounts. Then, when you login, CREST should tell the client all the accounts that have been authorized. This would allow WH mapping software to use two different browser windows for different characters. Either way, WH mapping software is definitely going to be VERY clunky from this point forward. So, I'm curious how this issue will be resolved? The mapping software can take care of the linking of accounts. Log in once, then log in a few more times to give the site some refresh tokens. Once that's done, it can track you, and show you all of the details at once. Not too hard to manage, really. Woo! CSM XI! Fuzzwork Enterprises Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter
Steve Ronuken Fuzzwork Enterprises Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM 6079	Posted - 2016.07.03 19:03:57 - [12] - Quote Geronimo McVain wrote: Steve Ronuken wrote: The mapping software can take care of the linking of accounts. Log in once, then log in a few more times to give the site some refresh tokens. Once that's done, it can track you, and show you all of the details at once. Not too hard to manage, really. That's not the real problem! Tripwire etc can get the datas from CREST but the problem is how do we!!! access Tripwire without the IGB? You made a connection to get datas out of Eve to the site but how do they give the processed datas back to the players inside Eve? Or better: How do we access these sides without closing the Eve window? Eve is outsourcing a lot of informations and the IGB was THE way to get it back to the players. someone listed all the shortcommings of the overlays. Could we please talk about this problem and the solution CCP is offering? Is CCP offering something? I don't think so and THAT's the problem! That's what an OOG browser, or a browser overlay is for? No need to shut down eve to do it. (run in fixed window, if you want to be able to alt tab, leaving Eve visible) Woo! CSM XI! Fuzzwork Enterprises Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter
Steve Ronuken Fuzzwork Enterprises Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM 6091	Posted - 2016.07.07 18:43:37 - [13] - Quote Speared wrote: "Working to the schedule stated in CCP FoxFour's dev blog" which to me is removing the browser from the client seems like a lot of work indeed. While I wasn't part of the discussion, and haven't seen the code, I _highly_ suspect the schedule is more giving people a chance to adjust, than to give CCP time to make the change. Edit: The internal discussion, that is. The plan to remove the IGB has been well known in the Third party development community, for a few years now. It's been held off on, as some functions for sites weren't available. They are now. I've yet to meet a third party dev who isn't happy they won't need to support the IGB for much longer. Total PITA to work with. Woo! CSM XI! Fuzzwork Enterprises Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter
Steve Ronuken Fuzzwork Enterprises Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM 6091	Posted - 2016.07.07 23:56:44 - [14] - Quote Speared wrote: If what you're saying is true then 3rd party devs care about as much about EVE players in this case as do CCP. I hope you're only speaking for yourself, though. Which bothers me as I always thought keeping as much functionality In-game should be everyone's goal. Ahem. You know that 3rd party devs (in almost all situations) make no money from providing services, and instead are forking out what can be a reasonable sum each month? Which means they're paying for you to use their services. And you say they don't care about Eve players? We also tend to be reasonable people, who've been talking to CCP for a fair time about this. This isn't a spur of the moment decision on CCP's part. It's been in the offing for _years_. Would it be nice to keep having an in game browser? Yes. Is the current one suitable, nope. Would it take a bunch of resources CCP could better spend elsewhere? Yes. That's the cost/benefit argument. Woo! CSM XI! Fuzzwork Enterprises Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter
Steve Ronuken Fuzzwork Enterprises Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM 6091	Posted - 2016.07.08 12:02:26 - [15] - Quote The problem with the argument "But they're spending time on [insert thing here]", is that not all code is equal. People have specialities. Integrating a new version of the browser is a very different code requirement, than putting in, say, docking animations. People _keep_ missing that. Woo! CSM XI! Fuzzwork Enterprises Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter
Steve Ronuken Fuzzwork Enterprises Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM 6096	Posted - 2016.07.10 02:45:44 - [16] - Quote Dex Cordell wrote: TL;DR the above, I've replied to the dev post already once, I'd stil like to know if CCP still didn't put this terrible idea on ice. I still wonder how hard it could be to get chromium put into the game, the code is already developed, getting security and bugfix updates is outside of the game devs responsibility, the chromium project guys take care of that, a ton of other normal game developers managed without any hassle about high development costs and all those other excuses of CCP. I beleive they used http://www.awesomium.com/ (which, iirc, is a fork of chromium) However, bear in mind that it has to be embedded into the 3d engine that Eve uses. (Which is custom. So no, it's not as simple as they make out) It's not a one off task though. Because you have to redo it each time they have a new release (unless you want to get into the situation we're in right now. which they don't want. Hence the removal) 'ton of other game developers'. Not that many really. it's far from a common feature. Woo! CSM XI! Fuzzwork Enterprises Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter
Steve Ronuken Fuzzwork Enterprises Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM 6150	Posted - 2016.08.31 20:16:17 - [17] - Quote Firnas wrote: CCP is in trouble. This sounds like company streamlining to reduce costs. Seen alongside the new free to play accounts, I worry for my EVE. Developers have been talking about getting rid of the IGB for _years_. They've just not been in a position to do so. (considering how little work has been put into the IGB for the last few years, this is hardly cost cutting) Woo! CSM XI! Fuzzwork Enterprises Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter
Steve Ronuken Fuzzwork Enterprises Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM 6224	Posted - 2016.10.18 15:36:07 - [18] - Quote Sian Neue wrote: It would seem that the only mapping software that allows you to set destinatins (Dotlan) from the old IGB isnt being updated, or at least has not been to allow you to do the destination setting via crest. So setting anyy destination is now fairly complicated as the ingame map isnt really good for that kind of thing. I am not a developer but couldnt the IGB just have stayed in game and sat there for these apps to use them and/or des anyone know of a mapping tool like dotlan that allows you to easily set a destination within the game. Question: How you do identify the system which you're wanting to go to? (you can always search for it with people and places) Woo! CSM XI! Fuzzwork Enterprises Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter
Steve Ronuken Fuzzwork Enterprises Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM 6249	Posted - 2016.11.11 12:23:32 - [19] - Quote Sian Neue wrote: @ Steve Ronuken I would be intterested in your reponse, you popped in answered with a question which I answered and now nothign... a bit like good mapping softare where i canset destinations from... i have nothing. Sian Neue wrote: Steve Ronuken wrote: Sian Neue wrote: It would seem that the only mapping software that allows you to set destinatins (Dotlan) from the old IGB isnt being updated, or at least has not been to allow you to do the destination setting via crest. So setting anyy destination is now fairly complicated as the ingame map isnt really good for that kind of thing. I am not a developer but couldnt the IGB just have stayed in game and sat there for these apps to use them and/or des anyone know of a mapping tool like dotlan that allows you to easily set a destination within the game. Question: How you do identify the system which you're wanting to go to? (you can always search for it with people and places) What I used to do was have dotlan open in the IGB with the tracking feature on, then find a system I want to go to choosing maybe by jumps, rats killed, ships killed etc, right click then off of one of the menus you could select that as a waypoint or destination and your route would be done, took seconds to do Now I have to open dotlan in an external browser (or overview), make a note of that system name, open people and places, make sure search type is any type in the system name (hoping that I have not done a typo like a 0 for a o, or a i for a 1 and when it comes up, right click the destination. Further evidence of the inconvenience of the IGB removal is say I wanted to travel to 9-FOB2 in Providence, I know it in my head as 9fob, but entering 9fob in search in game brings up nothing, so I have to look and remember there is a -, so I go to search and enter 9-fob, nothing appears (I am actually doing this in game as I type this Oh but it isnt 9-fob, it's 9-f0b (zero not an oh), now ive found it. What took literally seconds before took much longer. So yes I can search for it in people and places (assuming I know the correct spelling) but (in this example) using the feature in dotlan was easy and it was convenient, and now it is a lot more mucking around just to enter the name. I could use the in game map (hottible thing that that is) and I am presented with this, oh look there is 9-fob the very dull text up near the top.... or looking at dotlan in the next example, which is easier to see and use? I am in 9uy here 2 jumps from 9fob and it is still difficukt to immediately see. In Game Map - http://imgur.com/IBmj85G Dotlan - http://imgur.com/rJ9Oqrh I personally really just used dotlan in the IGB so that is where I am feeling frutrated, I wouldnt care if the IGB was taken out if the way that the map (dotlan) in this case was presented clearly to me, the in game map is not as easy to use as dotlan (see pictures) and I cannot see CCP developing an ingame map to have that same basic feel. It also looks like dotlan isnt developed any more, I emailed the creator with no answer, his characters KB was last updated in 2015 (although not a definitive indicator of being in game, judging by the corp he is in I would except more loses. Also saying that the information is there in crest for 3rd partes to use is great if 3rd parties do it, but if they dont then we are stuck... its like ship fittings, how can that be left to a 3rd party... what if no one every did a ship fitting tool, how do you think eve would look then? Ack. sorry. totally missed this response. I'm currently doing some layout work to build a map layout like dotlan. It's just slow going, as automatic layouts are somewhat painful to get working in a reasonable fashion. Once that's done, I may put in something which may do similar things. (bear in mind, if all you want to do is type a name to set a destination, you can do that from people and places) Woo! CSM XI! Fuzzwork Enterprises Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter